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1hockey
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Tydfil :) That is my point :) If a player was trying to manipulate a game and try and get an advantage surely if they knew they were going to lose points because of unfinished games they would endeavour to try and finish them on time. if the player who has a problem going into the last day with an unfinished game the option is to screen shot and send to judge. If they do not send a screen shot then "buyer beware" !! An automatic generated email reminding players of their predicament would ensure that both players tried to finish games on time. It is something that could be trialed by the league ???
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26/09 2016 08:16:56
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BinSoe, from german WF
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Hi,
a comment from a member in WF German, if I may ...
I would strongly second Captainkos´ thoughts about ".. (what) would help is not having back to back seasons"
Another thing just coming to my mind, just an idea, no further thinking about it done yet:
how about a points system like in (european) football? 3 points for a game won regularly (- including resigned games), 1 point each for any draw (including auto results), but only 2 points for an auto win?
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14/09 2016 18:37:37
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llucille
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I didn´t notice you did, Tydfil. But no worries. It is I who should apologize, for forgetting to spell your name at all! Lest there be any confusion, the McD Happpy Meal was for you.
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13/09 2016 05:31:07
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tydfil
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Many apologies for misspelling your un llucille
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13/09 2016 05:18:29
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tydfil
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Thank you so much Lucille it´s great - only have a Mac once/twice a year. I think that´s ok and poking tongue out at captainkos..so there. Re GPS ...I live in small town which gets above its station me thinks..lol geocaching thing.... armed response and bomb disposal ´cos someone placed a ´find´ in a telephone kiosk (they still exist) Goodness knows what they will do if a pokemon arrives. Probably call the UFO squad. Eek!! May I make it clear that I respect every effort made in the UK to thwart terrorist attacks. Respect!!
On the subject of autos which is what we are here about....I agree in general with what has been said. I think it should be observed that LoBot/Hal overrules itself and I think that should not be the case. Allow the rules to take their course unless, as the captain says, a player protests. I have been there and ´done it´ - no more table judging than already exists required in my opinion. Let the rules run their course unless a player requests an intervention. I don´t think there is a need for a ´gap´ captain but I do think that LoBot/Hal (I like Hal Lucille:)) should have his buttons pressed so that players can´t enter results for a season that has ended.
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13/09 2016 05:00:11
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llucille
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Your virtual Big Mac, fries, and Coke have now arrived. If your rail and chains are more than virtual, please send GPS coordinates. You are not alone:)
Only Eskil will know if Hal (er... Lobot) can be re-coded to assist us mere mortals in our oddessy of hurtling through the space and time of WFLoH.
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13/09 2016 03:46:37
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CaptainKos
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Okay. I may not be the most experienced player in this league and for that reason I bow to the experience and the eloquence of the ´old timers´, who have already commented on this thread, but I have been summoned to the stand by tydfil, and will therefore give my opinion.
I don´t agree that more volunteers are needed for table judging. Less intervention is needed. Too much time is wasted already at the end of each season checking tables etc. Surely table judging is only needed when a judgement needs to be made? After all, King Solomon didn´t bring every mother and child into his court to pass judgement on maternity. His judgement was needed when there was a dispute. I believe judgement should be made on promotion/relegation when there is a question raised by a player. If those in the group don´t flag anything up, then Lobots decision should stand. The wisdom of Solomon isn´t needed.
Take the case right at the beginning of this thread. I think it was right that there was intervention that would benefit wordsmith. However, if wordsmith had said nothing, then Lobots decision should stand. Even if another player was promoted on the back of numerous auto wins. Players need to learn to be more vocal or accept that they at times may lose out.
One thing I think would help is not having back to back seasons with no breathing space. If a season ended midnight on Friday, Lobot could work his magic and allow players 24hrs to see the outcome and flag something up for the table judges to consider. The admin team could then get some sleep. Admittedly, this would mean there would be only 13 days to complete games, though I don´t see that as a problem.
Finally. I take exception to one of tydfils comments and I seriously hope it doesn´t affect our future exchanges but........ Big Mac and fries?? Seriously??? ;)
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13/09 2016 02:47:11
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Captainkos
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@tydfil. The captain is thinking before posting :)
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12/09 2016 19:54:05
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tydfil
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Hi Lucille. It is good to see your post and know that another player has an interest:) I sometimes feel lonely chained to the railings but there I shall stay. If anyone is passing a Big Mac and regular fries wouldn´t go amiss. Small coke. I feel strongly on the subject. Players should not be penalised because someone else won´t/can´t play. Where is captainkos on this?
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12/09 2016 15:21:02
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llucille
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Tydfil´s concern that auto results often result in inequitable outcomes for players, sometimes even when players have communicated with judges before the end of season, is valid! I agree it´s a sad result when that happens, but because Tydfil says it is happening with ever-increasing frequency, my main take-away is that perhaps there are not enough volunteers for table-judging our games to ensure the "rules" of promotion / relegation are followed (in this case, it is more like an intention than a rule). Table judges must oversee thousands of auto results entered by a very well-trained Lobot at the end of each season. I have always been so impressed with the attention to detail and fair values of everyone who works in any capacity to keep this wonderful league both responsive to individuals and technologically running smoothly. Thank you Tydfil for calling this change to the attention of everyone. I am not in a position to fix anything but I appreciate the efforts and abilities of the many who are. You too, Tydfil, for your great communications, as always.
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12/09 2016 09:45:33
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tydfil
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@miniministoner great post. At the risk of being a pest I would very much welcome a response Eskil. I appreciate you are busy
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10/09 2016 11:45:46
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miniministoner
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I think Tydfil has a point. You shouldn´t be denied promotion or be relegated just because you benefit from an auto result, it should only be if you engineer a game not to finish.
She is also right that her examples are too boring to check out, but I think we all trust her that they support the point.
She is right again that it applies across languages, and also across games. It is even worse in the Quiz league because a genuine 6-0 is considered an unfinished game, it isn´t a problem at the moment because we are all too nerdy to let it happen, but if ever that league became popular there would be tears.
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10/09 2016 10:21:18
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tydfil
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Hi to the community. I am perfectly aware that people, not least the WLoH team will think I am obsessed re auto results. I am actually minded to chain myself to some virtual railings over the subject in the manner of a suffragette; I do not, however, feel sufficiently strongly/have too much self interest to go on hunger strike.
I would like to make it very clear that, in this post, I offer no criticism whatsoever of anybody involved in working to ensure the smooth running of the league and nor do I, in any way, cast blame on a player. I do suspect that LoBot (computer) is getting out of his cage occasionally and getting up to mischief unbeknownst to his keeper.
Until comparatively recent times the auto result rule was straightforward; a player could not gain advantage by deliberately stalling but in the absence of any such suspicion it would be carried and the outcome stood. It has become the case that players are usually not allowed to be promoted/escape relegation if it is on the back of an auto and that bothers me. I will give some examples that concern me:
Season 110 Div 8 group 127; only 1 player managed to complete a game with 2 uns. A player topped the group and took autos with all rest bar 1. They were denied promotion.
Season 111 div 7 group 2; There was clearly an issue with a un not accepting/completing. Players were asked to post. Some did not but 1 player had already posted and that post was acknowledged. Autos were awarded. The top 2 were denied promotion because they had been awarded autos. I think the outcome should have been allowed to stand in view of the obvious problem with a particular un but could live with the no. 1 not being promoted as they did not respond to the request. Number 3 was promoted because number 2 had benefited from an auto. Number 2 had posted and the post was substantiated by the rest of the activity in the group.
Season 111 div 7 group 21. Player 2 in the group was promoted because of the of the ´scale of auto win´; the scale was 150-0 as per the rules. Again there was a clear issue re a player not completing and in addition the winner of the group submitted screenshots demonstrating their efforts to finish. There would be many instances when player number 2 in a table could be promoted based on the winner having got a 150-0 whether from an auto or a resignation.
I could give other examples but am conscious people may be falling asleep whilst I am preparing the chains for the railings.
@Eskil I address this to you because the auto result rule is so fundamental that it must surely apply across every language in the league and you are the guardian of WLoH and LoBot´s keeper. I appreciate a human can intervene re LoBot but there appears to be confusion. If I am wrong would you/someone explain to me - in what circumstances is a player allowed to be promoted/escape relegation unhindered if they have been awarded an auto result?
Am now going to seek refuge because I don´t fancy the railings:)
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6/09 2016 00:02:55
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wordsmith(9)
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Thank you wloh int assistant. I might not be in division 7 for long, but I do play fair. :-)
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30/04 2016 22:48:29
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WLoH Int Assist
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Fixed
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30/04 2016 21:15:21
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WLoH Int Assist
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Yes, that appears to be a mistake by lobot. Let me take a look.
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30/04 2016 21:02:25
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wordsmith(9)
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I played 7 games and posted wins and losses. Was winning my last game with 1 tile left. How can someone who only posted 3 results win? They got 5 auto results of 150-0. I think if you don´t post a result you should get 0 points. If they can´t or won´t post why should they win. I´m very disgruntled. Perhaps I shouldn´t post half my results.
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30/04 2016 19:42:49
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